Continuity?

[una]

Do you guys prefer a story written in continuity or not?

I hear alot of people hate when someone writes out of canon.

[SkyxDB]

Honest to me it doesn't manner if a story is with in cannon or AU/or deviates from canon as long as it good.

Do me there's nothing wrong with AU or deviating from canon a little, becuase sometimes playing with alternatives to what happened in canon can be interesting.

But if a story sticks to canon then I'm fine with that too, becuase one can write good stories relating to canon events as well.

[una]

Honest to me it doesn't manner if a story is with in cannon or AU/or deviates from canon as long as it good.

Do me there's nothing wrong with AU or deviating from canon a little, becuase sometimes playing with alternatives to what happened in canon can be interesting.

But if a story sticks ot canon then I'm find with that too, becuase one can write good stories relating to canon events as well.

That's what I think too but it has to be realistic and fit somehow.

[Lady Venom]

My own preference is canon, and canon needs to stick to the time line. Otherwise, it is AU for me.

I don't care to read AU stories, so it's disconcerting and extremely jarring to read something and half way through, someone shows up or something isn't right.

I'm a canon whore, and study shows so I can write them better, and make sure everything is true to fault.

That's just me, and how I brought myself up into the fandoms..

Do a little warning if it's even a 'tad AU' is helpful, and I know plenty of people don't mind that, which is great! But for people like myself and others, we prefer a warning. ^.^

[Dalgaroth]

I honestly prefer canon. A little AU is okay but AU where they're turned human or something turns me off it. -_-

I'm currently writing a fic that's set after the canon where I take the canon, analyze it, and determine that no one died convincingly enough to be gone for good, save poor Scorponok. So would that be "canon" writing or AU? I don't think it's too AU, since I'm using and setting it in the canon.... >_> hmm..

[Lady Venom]

It would be a version of AU, yes. Because the canon is that everyone died.

Bringing them back to life because you felt like it, would be AU.

[Dalgaroth]

Hmm...yeh, I guess so. I see.

But going strictly by the show and what was shown, there were a couple deaths that no one actually SAID Hey, he's officially dead. It was implied. Or they left a loop hole, in case they wanted to bring the character back later (Terrorsaur). Rampage's spark was said to be modeled after Starsream's and said to be immortal. Once the explosion happened ( ;_; ) all we saw were DC's fins floating up on the water and OP looking sad. If Rampage was said to be immortal, and it held true, and THAT'S why he let go and laughed in DC's face, there's a chance he didn't die...but maybe DC did. Although I don't think an explosion's gonna kill him - thus, my fic. Also, while Tigerhawk was destroyed, Beast MAchines canon shows that a spark can be depolarized so that they're not confined to a body. Using that theory and that Tigatron and Airazor's sparks were able to float around for a while on their own and they possessed Tigerhawk's bod, then maybe when Tigerhawk was destroyed, their sparks were able to survive and got out of there. And while Inferno and Quickstrike were destroyed by the ship's fusion cannon, Inferno had survived through an energon explosion (like Depth Charge's and if Inferno is strong enough to survive a whole energon blast, I think DC could survive that blast underwater). Oh, and Tarantulas was possessed by the Vok before he blew up, and since the Vok were never discussed in the show, it left a huge loophole open for him. The only ones who died, to me, were Dinobot, Scorponok, and Quickstrike, but the latter I revived because my reviewers rally wanted to see him back, and the same thing wit Dinobot, although....I'm still thinking on how to make it canon-like.

GAH! Long post! DX Uh, basically, I built my fic on all the loopholes in the show. The Maximal's left the planet and went into the future again and apparently nothing was changed save for Megatron's hand in matters, so technically the time stream wasn't ruined right? But take a look at the loopholes - not everyone was said to have died in Beast Wars, the little Autobot shuttle couldn't possibly hold all the pieces of the Axalon and the Pred ship in it, and if DC and Rampage were the only aquatics in the show, then no one was able to retrieve DC or Dinobot's bodies or the Axalon, or anything underwater. And Beast Machines canon gives a ot of leeway when applied to Beast Wars sometimes.

So, all that said, I think the stuff that makes it AU, to me, is bringing back characters who don't have a loophole an some other stuff I just realized I don't have time to list. :'D Heh.

So, in the end, do you think I should add a label for those who wish to know something's AU? Or should I leave my summary alone?

[Lady Venom]

While I agree they were floating around, I think it was actually the help of the Vok in Beast Wars, in Beast Machines, well canon was screwed up the wazoo for that one, so I don't use BW/TF canon with BM, as it has it's own brand of logics(Waspinator heading back to Cybertron from the very first sling shot? Pff, yea THAT happened.. )

BUT, the Vok also combined the two sparks, and once a spark is combined like that, I do think it would be nay impossible to separate them. And remember, it was more of less, the possession of Tigerhawk through Vok means, not on their own really... The Vok did a lot of things in the series before they were destroyed, which would have otherwise been called on as plot holes.

For Depth Charge and Rampage, it could be reasoned (and quite easily) that Rampage DID survive the explosion. But if you look at season 1, you can see how quickly and deadly Energon was to the robotic body, and an explosion at such close range would surely have destroyed Depth Charge to itty bitty nothingness.

While others, I think the deaths of them were left 'open' as you say, more so because the writers didn't really play their cards right. Not doing anything for them merely because they weren't 'popular' in the show.

Now, back to the Vok, the Vok are discussed in great length throughout the show 0_o.... how you think they weren't is..well...

The floating island, the Stone Henge, the second moon that is actually a weapon. There are continual references to them. Just because they didn't show themselves till second season or so did not make them less of a strong influence on the planet. They were destroyed by Tarantulas's machine, therefore, you consider that after that, when your story is based, it's impossible to use the Vok, as they are the only ones we are shown.

They are the only ones working on this planet, and never before had they ever made reference to another planet, species, race.

--

Not being catty here, just going into Beta mode and pointing out flaws in the story. If you want a good story that everyone will love, you need to have people point out things instead of just patting you on the head and saying 'Good Job'.

[Nurann]

Sorry guys, I'm just skimming, so pardon my response if it seems a bit off.

I'm becoming a bit of a canon whore too. Never used to be, but the more reading I do, the worse I get. A little AU isn't so bad, as long as it's plausible. Otherwise I'm starting to skip those fics more and more...

Sorry, I don't mean to contradict you slightly LV, but Tigatron and Airazor become separate identities again in the Wrecker's comics... Same with DC in the Universe line. They are somewhat free game thanks to those story lines

[artemis-lady-warrior]

me I don't mind canon or AU if the AU isn't something totally weird.. like making somebody turn into an animal or a lamp.

Speaking of AU wouldn't the Shattered Glass comic be considered a canon AU? Since it makes the Decepticons good and the Autobots bad?

When I write fics. not counting Aftermath and Organic (seeing as those are HUGE AU fics).. I tend to do stories before, between or after the set timelines. Mostly because there is so much stuff that could happen during that time which is never touched on.

[Lady Venom]

Sorry guys, I'm just skimming, so pardon my response if it seems a bit off.

I'm becoming a bit of a canon whore too. Never used to be, but the more reading I do, the worse I get. A little AU isn't so bad, as long as it's plausible. Otherwise I'm starting to skip those fics more and more...

Sorry, I don't mean to contradict you slightly LV, but Tigatron and Airazor become separate identities again in the Wrecker's comics... Same with DC in the Universe line. They are somewhat free game thanks to those story lines

Than she'll need to specify that it's based off Comic continuity, since I and I'm sure some others, weren't aware of the comics or just never read them, and as such, have no idea about it's story line.

[Dalgaroth]

Oh, no no, Lady Venom, thank you. n_n A chance to state and try to defend my position and then taking your advice and your opinions and listening is really helpful. Honestly I've never opened my story up for betaing before, I did my own, but hearing real critique is really important.

As far as the story goes:

Before they merged, they were still two separate sparks. And since we don't know much about the nature of sparks, except a few glimpses at theory or whatever during the show, theorizing that yes, they can separate, is, imo, just as possible as not being able to separate. In my story, they did that to become one, and then after they were destroyed, they were dying, so in order to sustain each other's sparks without energon or a body, they merged every once in a while, kinda like keeping each other warm if they were cold. Part of my story is theorizing how sparks work, based on canon from the show.

for DC... :/ Inferno's strong and badaft, but so is DC. Inferno blasted a whole pile of energon to try to destroy the Maximals and because of all the panic over energon overload, I was SURE he was dead. xDD I mourned. Next episode, he stumbles out, disoriented and hops right up next to Megatrn again to help him fight/arge with Optimus. xD

I srsly think Depth Charge is capable of doing that too, especially if he has the will to get back up and make dead sure Rampage is gone. :'D No, in my story, it gets AU right off te back. The energon crystal he used to kill Rampage acted liek a cunductor (like quartz) and caused their sparks to fuse. Therefore, DC was able to heal completely. Despite that, however, if I left their sparks alone, I still think there's a CHANCE he survived and it's that chance I'm using in my story.

The others were certainly given open deaths. I understand Taratulas came back from the dead because of the Vok i nthe comics and Tigatron and Airazor did too, but I'm not basing my stories on them. I merely use them for validation to see what the writers thought would be possible or not. When it comes to the Vok, they were talked about at length in the show, but never [iexplained[/i]. No one in the show said they were invincible, or godly, or descendants of te Swarm, or scientists. Their Scientist nature was implied, and that's the basis of my theory for them. Anything I say about the Vok is based on what we know from the show, only using the comics and other continuities as validation or reference.

About Beast Machines... since technically it is the sequel, it's possible to blend the canon. Not entirely, of course, (and I think BM is a HORRIBLE sequel to BW, although I think it's good in its own right,) but it did offer some insight into current and historical Cybertronian spirituality, legend, myth, and Truth. Even though they didn't quite fit G1 or Beast Wars, their ideas can still be used to validate things that happened in BW. So, I use that. Waspinator? No way he got to Cybertron by being flung by a tree. -_- But then, Thrust didn't exactly remember everything.

Oh wait, the Vok again - once more, in the show, the Vok's abilities and physical prowess were not explained either. From what we saw, they were able to create physical things and send them to earth, and they could also possess physical things and give them life like sparks. (Tigerhawk seemed like Tigatron with a cold, sinister twist, possibly because his programming was the same as Tigatron's but he had a different spark - Vok. The Vok may or may not be able to puppet directly fro mthe spark chamber, but maybe they give a general direction while they're in there, while the programming carries it out. Like switching souls but not minds.). But physical things cannot affect them the same way they can hurt other physical things. So, in my story, I say that the Vok pieced Tarantulas's body back together using powers, not pretty, and used two blank protoforms to give themselves bodies, bodies they upgrade, in order to destroy the bots themselves, in person. They can't float around on their own for very long, according to my story's manipulating of the canon, because our world is a huge mix of physical and energetic Ness that "tears" at the delicate ethereal/physical essence of the Spark or Vok. so they need bodies. I figure that, until you see them in that one episode for like 3 seconds, they always have a body of some sort. And then the ray blew Tarantulas up, but the Vok are powerful anyways, so his destruction doesnt necessarily mean his death. Especially since he's not a Primus Behbeh. :/ He be a Unicron Behbeh.

Supposedly. >:3 There's a CHANCE he's not, although I dunno what else he'd be if he's not. >_> lol

What I plan to do in the story is bring Beast Wars back into Beast Machines. I'm letting Beast Machines run its course in the future, but maybe Optimus isn't quite on the right path. The Oracle and all that was VERY vague and eventually started to be manipulated by Megatron so its canon isn't definite :/ so the whole "Seeds of the future lie buried in the past?"

LOL, maybe that's the Oracle's way of saying, "Dude. You left peeps back on Earth. They can help you win." :'D


lol I think this is kinda off topic wit the topic, but I'm interested in hearing what you have to say. :'D (Oh, and btw, IIFFF you read my story. . . um, please keep in mind that sometimes it gets messy or something doesn't quie fit sith something else. I still have to fix those things since translating from my understanding from my brain to the comp is for some reason difficult in some cases. -_-)

[Alak]

While I agree they were floating around, I think it was actually the help of the Vok in Beast Wars, in Beast Machines, well canon was screwed up the wazoo for that one, so I don't use BW/TF canon with BM, as it has it's own brand of logics(Waspinator heading back to Cybertron from the very first sling shot? Pff, yea THAT happened.. )

Actually, that's a misconception. Waspinator being slung-shot was fore comedic purposes. He traveled back to Cybertron on his own power (being a flier and all, but the science still doesn't make sense since it'd take more than just a couple hundred years). Also, since you're a lover of canon-based fan fiction, isn't it counter-intuitive to disregard the Beast Machines continuity?

BUT, the Vok also combined the two sparks, and once a spark is combined like that, I do think it would be nay impossible to separate them.

Like Nurann said, the Vok separated the sparks in the "Wreckers". However, I strongly feel that the canon of this comic line is debatable since it was never even completed. Plus, a lot of the events that happened in there were a bit...sketchy.

for DC... :/ Inferno's strong and badaft, but so is DC. Inferno blasted a whole pile of energon to try to destroy the Maximals and because of all the panic over energon overload, I was SURE he was dead. xDD I mourned. Next episode, he stumbles out, disoriented and hops right up next to Megatrn again to help him fight/arge with Optimus. xD

I srsly think Depth Charge is capable of doing that too, especially if he has the will to get back up and make dead sure Rampage is gone. :'D No, in my story, it gets AU right off te back. The energon crystal he used to kill Rampage acted liek a cunductor (like quartz) and caused their sparks to fuse. Therefore, DC was able to heal completely. Despite that, however, if I left their sparks alone, I still think there's a CHANCE he survived and it's that chance I'm using in my story.

Like Nurann said, the Universe comics confirmed DC's death. Optimus Primal chose to bring him and Rhinox back to life, and you have to actually have to be dead in order to be brought back to life.

Oh wait, the Vok again - once more, in the show, the Vok's abilities and physical prowess were not explained either. From what we saw, they were able to create physical things and send them to earth, and they could also possess physical things and give them life like sparks. (Tigerhawk seemed like Tigatron with a cold, sinister twist, possibly because his programming was the same as Tigatron's but he had a different spark - Vok. The Vok may or may not be able to puppet directly fro mthe spark chamber, but maybe they give a general direction while they're in there, while the programming carries it out. Like switching souls but not minds.). But physical things cannot affect them the same way they can hurt other physical things. So, in my story, I say that the Vok pieced Tarantulas's body back together using powers, not pretty, and used two blank protoforms to give themselves bodies, bodies they upgrade, in order to destroy the bots themselves, in person. They can't float around on their own for very long, according to my story's manipulating of the canon, because our world is a huge mix of physical and energetic Ness that "tears" at the delicate ethereal/physical essence of the Spark or Vok. so they need bodies. I figure that, until you see them in that one episode for like 3 seconds, they always have a body of some sort. And then the ray blew Tarantulas up, but the Vok are powerful anyways, so his destruction doesnt necessarily mean his death. Especially since he's not a Primus Behbeh. :/ He be a Unicron Behbeh.

Go for it. Despite being a huge factor in the cartoon, we really don't know the full extent of what the Vok are capable of. We knew they could build big infrastructures that can generate and focus energy on a target, and such weapons can differentiate between energy weaponry and sentient energy signatures. We found out only 3 episodes before the series finale that they could fuse sparks, inhabit other lifeforms, pass through solid matter, create a new body from their natural energy, etc. "The Wreckers" only adds to their list of powers, so I'm sure your story won't ruin the canon at all. Anything you can come up with is plausible.

What I plan to do in the story is bring Beast Wars back into Beast Machines.

That's awesome. I personally have always wanted to see how a BW fan would revamp BM, and I reimagined it many times myself. Can't wait to read it.

[Dalgaroth]

Thanks! I'm still not sure if Beast Machines will be a second fic, but in the end of my story, DC and his group end up back at Cybertron where their actions in the past helped change the future and in turn the Maximals currently trying to save Cybertron. But in doing so, they also help change the nature of Beast Machines and I start to blend the canon of both so that Beast Machines is more Beast Warsish AND is written a way I like. However, I COULD go back and assume everyone's dead and rewrite only Beast MAchines the way I'd want it to go which was another idea I had but it doesn't have my faves in it, save Jetstorm but...yeah. lol!!!

Another idea was to change the Nemesis episodes and continue the Beast Wars in a Fourth Season. Surely I'm not the only one who thought of this, but I've yet to read one I liked.

the "Wreckers"

:shakes head: Like I said, I'm disregarding the comics and retconned stuff, except for the couple times that I've used them as reference to determine if something could be considered a canon possibility in my story. Probably the biggest insertion of fanon I'm doing is the whole bonding thing, since that's never happened in the shows. I'm reallly trying hard to explore loopholes in the canon and explain stuff in canon that was never explained, to construct my story.

According the comics, DC is dead and is revived at some point and blah, but I am not considering it canon for my fics since it didn't come first. The show did. :/ For the purposes of my story, I'm ignoring the Extra Canon and going with the original canon so I can play around with what that gave me. I never read the comics, so I wouldn't know the ins and outs and subtleties of them, so I can't use them anyway. n_n

[Alak]

Thanks! I'm still not sure if Beast Machines will be a second fic, but in the end of my story, DC and his group end up back at Cybertron where their actions in the past helped change the future and in turn the Maximals currently trying to save Cybertron. But in doing so, they also help change the nature of Beast Machines and I start to blend the canon of both so that Beast Machines is more Beast Warsish AND is written a way I like. However, I COULD go back and assume everyone's dead and rewrite only Beast MAchines the way I'd want it to go which was another idea I had but it doesn't have my faves in it, save Jetstorm but...yeah. lol!!!

Another idea was to change the Nemesis episodes and continue the Beast Wars in a Fourth Season. Surely I'm not the only one who thought of this, but I've yet to read one I liked.

Nice idea, maybe Tigerhawk will actually live for more than 24 hours lol.

the "Wreckers"

:shakes head: Like I said, I'm disregarding the comics and retconned stuff, except for the couple times that I've used them as reference to determine if something could be considered a canon possibility in my story. Probably the biggest insertion of fanon I'm doing is the whole bonding thing, since that's never happened in the shows. I'm reallly trying hard to explore loopholes in the canon and explain stuff in canon that was never explained, to construct my story.

According the comics, DC is dead and is revived at some point and blah, but I am not considering it canon for my fics since it didn't come first. The show did. :/ For the purposes of my story, I'm ignoring the Extra Canon and going with the original canon so I can play around with what that gave me. I never read the comics, so I wouldn't know the ins and outs and subtleties of them, so I can't use them anyway. n_n

Well, the comics take place after the events of Beast Machines, so it's only logical that they're published after the tv series ends. I'm still a bit uncertain on the significance of the whole "bonding" thing. Is it going to be like the bond that Rampage and Dinobot II had, or will DC and Rampage have the ability to merge together like Star Saber + Victory Leo = Victory Saber? Oh, and disregarding the Universe comic line means that you're missing out on Depth Charge going all Batman on a corrupt Blackarachnia: