Maximal...or Predacon?

[una]

CURSE YOU HEROES, AND YOUR INSANE ABILITY TO DEFY ALL LOGIC AND WIN EVERY SITUATION WITHOUT FAIL! CURSE YOU I SAY!

GOOD Always prevails!

[VelociBerg]

Silverbolt, Wow! Blackarachnia, WOW!! Silverbolt + Blackarachina, WOOOW!!!!!

Eh? I always thought SB+BA would = Blackbolt, or Silverarachnia, or something.

yyyyeah....you're crazy. lay off the energon cubes, k?

Ah yes, of course. The typical Maximal response to the words of TRUTH--namely, declaring the truth-speaking Predacon insane, a heretic, radical, and so forth. Your Minimal wiles will not silence me, noooo!

GOOD Always prevails!

"The Predacons will have their moment."

[Lady Ocelot]

Oi! Leave Waspinator alone. The poor bug's been through enough already without getting wet ^^

...

...Oh, me?

Ummz...dangit! These kind of questions always throw me. I think that when baddies become good and the kind-hearted corrupt, who can you really trust? I believe that the good guys are doing the right thing when it comes to loyalty based on respect and not fear, but the baddies do have a point with not living by the rulebook and having the hard touch when it is necessary. Morals are a great thing to have, but it's not practical to have them all the time. You can't always live your life dedicated to the greater good - a lot of the time survival needs to come first. It's sometimes better to retreat and regroup to a more tactical vantage point and not run suicide missions for either cause, because once you're gone who will be left to fight for what you believe in?

Sooo...my verdict?

Yes peoples, I'm a neuter! Stick me in the Other category

Eh? I always thought SB+BA would = Blackbolt, or Silverarachnia, or something.

And you wouldn't be wrong - http://www.supermegatopia.com/tmbgr/gal ... achnia.htm

[VelociBerg]

Nothin' wrong with staying on the fence LO!

And you wouldn't be wrong - http://www.supermegatopia.com/tmbgr/gal ... achnia.htm

The Horror...the horror...

[SilverfromOZ]

GAAAGGHH! Curse my lack of online time. Well lets throw out three points for my arguement then I'll rant later:

1) I'm Silver

2) I think the Maxi symbol looks better and

...uhhh...


3) Good guys will ALWAYS win (in the long run)

... to be continued

[Jagna]

SILVER UR BACK!! *over it now*

Lady O: that's godd....but SCARY AS HELL! RUUUUUUUUN!

[una]

Boltarachina? THE NEW MAXIMAL!!!!!

[Unvereitletmann]

I think definitely the bad guys suit me better. I voted predacon side (of coourse!). First of all cause I think of them as the only engine of the story. Without them the beast wars might never be fought! Also their constant problems within them brought great ideas to the story (like that Victory episode). Second I like the characters more, especially Megatron and Tarantulas, cause they were really developed personalities, and their constant search for victory in their own terms made as well good episodes. Third, I liked more their beast modes. And fourth, Megatron was the real winner of the Beast Wars right? so why not?
The only problem that stops both predacons and decepticons from winning, is their own power desire and the consequent all-time back stabbing among them.

[Blazemane]

First of all cause I think of them as the only engine of the story. Without them the beast wars might never be fought!

Without the maximals, the beast wars wouldn't have been fought. Megatron would have sweeped energon and taken over Cybertron. Definitely no conflict without maximals.

Third, I liked more their beast modes.

Disagree, but t-Rex's are commendable.

And fourth, Megatron was the real winner of the Beast Wars right? so why not?

Because he's the bad guy. Still you do have good points, but really, aren't good guys well... good, for a reason? But, like I said, good points.

As for me, I chose maximals for reasons that are explained previously in this post.

[VelociBerg]

Without the maximals, the beast wars wouldn't have been fought. Megatron would have sweeped energon and taken over Cybertron. Definitely no conflict without maximals.

Blazemane has a point Unvereitletmann. Cheetor did fire the first shots of the Wars, despite the fight in space above the planet prior to those shots. However, without Predacons breaking away there wouldn't any conflict at all. Period. The Maximals would continue on their voyage of exploration/disposing of Protoform X while Megatron conquered the universe.

...

Search your feelings you know it to be true.

Disagree, but t-Rex's are commendable.

As the seasons progressed soon Megatron was the only one that wasn't an insect or arachnid (before Rampage), so the Maximals definitely had more variety. But the dragon was definitely the best beast mode.

Because he's the bad guy.

*is confused by that sentence*

Still you do have good points, but really, aren't good guys well... good, for a reason? But, like I said, good points.

They have to be good to represent the polar opposite of the evil side, fight the bad guys and present heroes to adoring fans of course!

[Unvereitletmann]

As the seasons progressed soon Megatron was the only one that wasn't an insect or arachnid (before Rampage), so the Maximals definitely had more variety.

I do agree with this. Having a rich in fossils planet (and the protoforms able to scan them) how could they miss having other dinosaur like warriors? Both Megatron and Dinobot were tough and cool. Terrorsaur... well at least he tried. (Haha!)
And even not having the dinosaur approach how about reptiles? They are another group that's cool for predacon beast modes.

But anyway the maximals where most likely all mammals. So in that way I think they didn't have more variety. Dinobot wasn´t a mammal cause his beast mode was origined as a predacon model, and Airazor was a bird to spice up the group. Depthcharge was I think one the coolest beast mode maximal cause his form had nothing to do with conventional animals. Most of the maximals remind me of classical Zoo models, like the ape, the rhino , the tiger, and stuff. So I do agree there's this bright idea for his beast mode. Returning to the topic aside from them who wasn't a mammal?

I really have thought over this in the past, and what I think is that animators never tried to have variety at all. My conclusion is that they developed the beast modes according to the characters. Like having optimus being a gorilla (an animal that people think as one of the most human-like) for example and other animals we tend to identify with ourselves through human history as models for their physical abbilities for the heroes. And for the evil side, animals that most people would tend to dislike or even be afraid of. Like spiders, and scorpions. In this way Megatron had to be a strong animal. Still they couldn't turn him into a lion or something like that, cause he broke the scheme then. So I think giving him the throne of the cretaceous period (turning him into a T-Rex) was the smartest thing to do.
In this theory the vewier could take part in another level of the war, you know like identify again with the good guys and in that sense develop a true identity of the show for him/her self

PREDACONS RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Blazemane]

However, without Predacons breaking away there wouldn't any conflict at all. Period. The Maximals would continue on their voyage of exploration/disposing of Protoform X while Megatron conquered the universe.

Yah, I think Unvereitletmann covered that idea already. Sure, I agree that the preds were the instigators. I guess that my point is both sides are needed for Beast Wars.

As the seasons progressed soon Megatron was the only one that wasn't an insect or arachnid (before Rampage), so the Maximals definitely had more variety. But the dragon was definitely the best beast mode.

Given, unless you want to be nitpicky and say that Quickstrike was partly a snake. Dragon, best beast mode? Probably, dragons are cool, but (and most people will think I'm crazy) I really liked Silverbolt's beast mode more. 'Twas awesome.

Quote:
Because he's the bad guy.


*is confused by that sentence*

Don't be confused, the good guys are good and the bad guys are bad. Being bad is not good.

Search your feelings you know it to be true.

They have to be good to represent the polar opposite of the evil side, fight the bad guys and present heroes to adoring fans of course!

Why do you say that? I mean think about it, you're a fan of the predacons which are the polar opposite of the maximals. And really, what if evil was allowed to prevail in the end? This world would be a nightmare.

Both Megatron and Dinobot were tough and cool. Terrorsaur... well at least he tried. (Haha!)

Megatron=cool, si. Dinobot=cool, si Still, remember, Dinobot was not I repeat not a predacon. Oh, sure he claimed he was. Heck, he even believed he was. But he still fought the predacons. Remember Fallen Comrades? Megatron gave him a chance to rejoin the predacons, even offering him an enticing re-entry post: second in command! What was his response? "Eat slag!" Now, I know what you're thinkin'. Dinobot was just mad at Megatron, he wasn't supporting the maximals so much as he was attacking the preds. There might have been some of that, but I'm going to bet that a great deal of it was the maximal loyalty that was slowly building in him. If you need a further example, go to Code of Hero. Every bullet that bounced of Dinobot tore of Maximal metal. Every scratch he got etched off Maximal paint. Every step he took was guided by maximal ideals. Now others may argue other reasons why he was down there, but I'll argue with 'em every step of the way.

As for Terrorsaur, I'm not a pred fan, but don't bash him. He was one of the beast modes I liked.

PREDACONS RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'd be depressed if they did. Maximals forever.

Anyways, you guys had some good points, but maximals are just plain cooler. Sorry.

[VelociBerg]

Given, unless you want to be nitpicky and say that Quickstrike was partly a snake.

Well, at one short point before Quickstrike it was purely an arachnesect Predacon crew save Megs.

Dragon, best beast mode? Probably, dragons are cool, but (and most people will think I'm crazy) I really liked Silverbolt's beast mode more. 'Twas awesome.

Hey, any beast mode that can stand toe-to-toe with OOP's robot mode and last more than a second against Tigerhawk deserves the title of awesome.

Don't be confused, the good guys are good and the bad guys are bad. Being bad is not good.

No. I am confused because I didn't know how "because he's the bad guy" pertains to this quote:

And fourth, Megatron was the real winner of the Beast Wars right? so why not?

Because he's the bad guy. Still you do have good points, but really, aren't good guys well... good, for a reason? But, like I said, good points.

But I get it now.

Why do you say that? I mean think about it, you're a fan of the predacons which are the polar opposite of the maximals. And really, what if evil was allowed to prevail in the end? This world would be a nightmare.

I was being sarcastic. And evil did prevail for a time, hence the whole plot of Beast Machines.

Megatron=cool, si. Dinobot=cool, si Still, remember, Dinobot was not I repeat not a predacon. Oh, sure he claimed he was. Heck, he even believed he was. But he still fought the predacons.

Simply fighting against Predacons =/= being a Maximal. Heck, the Predacons fight each other only slightly less than fighting the Maximals. However, was Dinobot a Predacon? No. He was a Maximal. Prior to the Beast Wars he was a Predacon, undeniably.

Remember Fallen Comrades? Megatron gave him a chance to rejoin the predacons, even offering him an enticing re-entry post: second in command! What was his response? "Eat slag!" Now, I know what you're thinkin'. Dinobot was just mad at Megatron, he wasn't supporting the maximals so much as he was attacking the preds. There might have been some of that, but I'm going to bet that a great deal of it was the maximal loyalty that was slowly building in him.

Maximal loyalty? Yes, I'd say that was half of it. But I'm betting it was also a chance to get back at Megatron (the loyalty would build even further as time went by) Remember the last time he was second in command? Got blasted halfway to the Maximal base. Also, I'm pretty sure Dinobot's BS meter was going off while Megatron was talking.

If you need a further example, go to Code of Hero. Every bullet that bounced of Dinobot tore of Maximal metal. Every scratch he got etched off Maximal paint.

What's the difference between Maximal and Predacon paint/metal? They're all Cybertronians.

Every step he took was guided by maximal ideals. Now others may argue other reasons why he was down there, but I'll argue with 'em every step of the way.

Maximal ideals? Or simply doing what was right? Also, how do you explain Maximal No More?

I'd be depressed if they did. Maximals forever.

Right...cuz, ya know, it wasn't the Predacons that made themselves second-class citizens, and it wasn't the Predacons that made Rampage.

[Blazemane]

Well, at one short point before Quickstrike it was purely an arachnesect Predacon crew save Megs.

True.

Hey, any beast mode that can stand toe-to-toe with OOP's robot mode and last more than a second against Tigerhawk deserves the title of awesome.

Megatron had power? Oh heck yah. Still, I wasn't talkin' 'bout power. I was continuing in the style of the argument about the looks of them, for example talking about the maximals being zoo creatures. Silverbolt just plain looks awesome. Could Megatron swoop down and eat him like Terrorsaur ate that bird in Power Surge? Probably.

And evil did prevail for a time, hence the whole plot of Beast Machines.

Like I said, nightmare.

Simply fighting against Predacons =/= being a Maximal. Heck, the Predacons fight each other only slightly less than fighting the Maximals. However, was Dinobot a Predacon? No. He was a Maximal. Prior to the Beast Wars he was a Predacon, undeniably.

Yeah, he was before Beast Wars. I'm not arguing that. But it's true.

Maximal loyalty? Yes, I'd say that was half of it. But I'm betting it was also a chance to get back at Megatron (the loyalty would build even further as time went by) Remember the last time he was second in command? Got blasted halfway to the Maximal base. Also, I'm pretty sure Dinobot's BS meter was going off while Megatron was talking.

I think we're doing nothing short of agreeing here. There were other factors, I'm just saying there was definite maximal influence.

What's the difference between Maximal and Predacon paint/metal? They're all Cybertronians.

You know what I mean.

[Blazemane]

Sorry for the double post. I had to leave in the middle of the last one. So, continuing on...

Maximal ideals? Or simply doing what was right? Also, how do you explain Maximal No More?

First, when I say maximal ideals, I mean doing right. In my mind, it's the same thing. I know you disagree by the last thing you say and I'll get to that. Now, as for Maximal, no More. Thanks for mentioning it. It further explains what Dinobot did in Code of Hero. At the beginning of the episode Dinobot was thinking "What's so wrong with preds. What's so right with maximals?" So off he skips into pred ground. My favorite character accidentally pounds Dinobot in the ground with his own falling weight and Dinobot is apprehended by the pyromaniac. Dinobot wakes up, once again proves he could whoop anybody, but still joins the preds.
Dinobot destroys Quickstrike, gives Megatron a disk, is saved by Rattrap, then hurts Rattrap anyways. Megatron says "kill". Then Dinobot looks and then, in my opinion, comes to full 100% realization of the preds' and mainly Megatron's insanity and also realizes as he stands over his true comrade with a sword poised to kill, just what horrible ends he can, and almost does, come to under Megatron's banner. I think when he lets his sword droop, he is fully a maximal. That's why he fights the preds in Code of Hero. That's how he was guided through the valley by maximal ideas, fighting, as a maximal.

Right...cuz, ya know, it wasn't the Predacons that made themselves second-class citizens, and it wasn't the Predacons that made Rampage.

.

I recall that the predacons and maximals had achieved peace, even though, as Megatron mentioned in his speech in Beast Wars Part 1 that it was pretended. He also notes in that speech "We Predacons have never abandoned our rightful goal of intergalactic conquest, noo." So, if the preds had their way, they'd have total control over everything and all others would be horribly oppressed, as opposed to the maximals who probably had a small touch of the upper hand (I'll admit that's by no means good, if it's true. I know Megatron claimed the predacon existence on Cybertron was slavery, but the conditions are probably far better than that. Anybody would use anything as a way to gain support for intergalactic conquest, yesss...). The maximals had no intention to make predacons worse off and probably believed they were happy since the predacons did feign peace. I know the show didn't make it sound completely like that, but the maximals were written as the good guys of the story. That's why you can trust that their intentions were pure and that Cybertron probably wasn't as bad as can be thought. I know people like to write fics about the maximals being partially corrupt (oo, I need to write a rant about this), but that's not what the show presented.

But, I do notice the show gives mixed signals about that. A good argument could easily be made for both sides. As for Rampage, this is one I'm not so wishy-washy on. Here's my opinion: the maximals made a robot with a nearly immortal spark; Rampage made Rampage.

This is fun. It's nice talking to another fan about Beast Wars. It lets out about 7 or 8 years of suppressed, and hardly understood by many who know me, fanaticism for the best show to ever hit television.